1993-04-11-Rebellion Adjudicated 1984

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Topic: Rebellion Adjudicated

Group: SE Idaho TeaM


Teacher: Iruka

TR: Pam




Iruka: . ..surrounds you, the Light of God enfolds you, the power of God protects you, wherever you are He is. Good afternoon, I am Iruka, I am your friend and teacher. What a delightful afternoon this has turned out to be. The warm sunlight and the birds are a sign of spring, and it is so nice to be able to sit outside. I wish to express to you my affection and my delight in your spiritual growth. You are working very hard, you have made this a priority in your life and you are indeed showing love to those around you. You have grown towards the Father, you have taken steps towards the light, it has not been easy. Can you pause for a moment and look back on where you were six months ago? How you approached a problem, how you approached an undesirable or unlovely person, someone you wish to avoid? Can you see the strides you have grown in just a few short months, that now you show love where before you avoided them. Now you engage them in conversation when before you only said what was necessary. I can see a growth, but I wanted you to be able to see your own. As you grow, you learn to love more. Growth is not easy, it is sometimes painful, but can you see how good it feels to have this love shine through you? You can walk with confidence and love and talk to almost anyone, and they cannot be a threat to you because you have the love from the Father. Sometime this week, think about the changes that have happened within you and marvel that this is just the beginning, this is just the first step. There are so many more exciting things to learn, to develop, and grow. Following the Father is truly an adventure, a thrill, not always easy but always worthwhile. This was not my lesson for this afternoon, but I see I have gotten carried away. But I did want you to recognize your own growth.

Our assignment for last week was to change the course of a conversation that was turning, or that had already turned, negative. This is hard to do at first, but with practice it becomes easier and if you had a chance to try it the reaction is not nearly as negative as you fear it will be. I would like to pause and see if anyone had the opportunity to change a conversation and if you feel comfortable, relate it to the group and tell if it was a positive experience to share your feelings and thoughts with others.

  • Pause for sharing by group

I appreciate those who did, it is taking a risk. I think that half the battle is being aware and just noticing that the conversation is getting negative and noticing what you are saying, your words, how you are communicating or even how you are saying your words. And this is what I wanted you to become aware of, and I think that it can be difficult because so often times we talk without thinking or we talk without meaning what we say. So this was an exercise for you to notice your words. I will leave you with the same assignment since it will be several weeks before we meet like this again. Just notice how you say your words and what words you choose, and the impact they have on the other person. It is just something to become aware of, how others are perceiving you. If your goal is to show love, of course you want others to be aware of the love. You don't want certain phrases or attitudes to take away from that love. So you see this is the next step, you are showing love very, very freely. Now we are working on the perception of how people are seeing you and this love. I will now take questions.


S1: Hello Iruka, I got an interesting phone call from the west coast of the United States. There will be someone joining us from the nation of Chile. Are you aware of this gal, do you know anything about her or anything we could do to help her get settled here?

Iruka: I am aware that there will be a visitor for several months here, merely show her love and help if she asks for it. If she is used to a big metropolitan area she will just have to get used to the roads and the transit systems. She may need help with that, but just show her friendship and love and listen to her. See what she needs, oftentimes moves can be stressful and she may just want to talk. So play it by ear and just meet her and get to know her. Does this help?

Evil, Rebellion, Judgment

G3: Hello Iruka, my question is concerning what part does the devil play in our everyday affairs or our everyday living. You very seldom talk about the evilness in the world and mostly when we have our lessons you mostly speak about the love of God. I do have a friend who is very concerned about the power of evil and the devil and sometimes she will say that such and such a person is possessed by the devil and this has been a conversation that we have debated over whether or not a person can be possessed by the devil. And also is there a such a place, physical place, material place as hell. Does that still exist or what is...could you help me out with these two questions?

Iruka: Certainly, I will try. On the planet Urantia, there has been one word, one name for three individuals. When you refer to the devil humans usually refer to an individual named Satan, one named Lucifer, or one named Caligastia. They are sort of rolled up into one being and called the devil, and since 1984 when the Lucifer Rebellion was adjudicated, these beings are as if they never were. They do not exist anymore. There was a time that humans could be, possessed is not a very descriptive term, but overwhelmed might be a better word. But since Jesus walked your planet this does not happen anymore, it cannot happen. The evil that is here is created by man. As there becomes more and more love in the world, this will dissipate, this will go away by itself. It takes enormous energy to sustain evil, and it will not last, it will go away. You don't need to be afraid of someone taking over your personality, your will, your desires and making you do things or think things that you don't want to.


As for the subject of hell, that was created centuries ago for people who appeared to have everything. Money, power, and so to make the poor people feel better about the rich person who was evil and had all this money, they were told that he would spend his eternity in a place where he would be eternally punished, in pain, on fire, some horrible thing would happen to him. This idea has been created by humans. The Father has such capacity for love, He doesn't want to loose even one of His creatures, one of his children. But if they choose to not serve Him, or move towards Him, or grow to be like Him, they can decide to not exist. It would be terribly painful for the Father if Lucifer was in a place where he was miserable, where he was in pain, where he hurt. Even in Lucifer's error, the Father still loved him. The Father is incapable of wishing this type of torment on anyone, even someone who has turned against Him. So in answer to your question, no there is no place like hell. The Father could not stand it. Does this help?

G3: Yes, there is a lady I can't recall her name, I was supposed to write it down. Mary somebody who wrote a book about her spiritual experiences with God and she claimed that the Father took her on a walk through hell and showed her what would happen if she didn't change her life, turn her life around and that He took her through burning. She saw people burning and people screaming and just the way it is described in the Bible and also the way most people consider hell to be. A burning inferno or whatever, anyway she claims that this was her experience that God took her on a walk through hell. So that is the reason why I had the question is there really a place called hell. This is a woman who is still alive today and who wrote this book I think several years ago and a friend of mine read it and she is wondering did that really happen to this woman or was it something in her mind or some type of a dream that she had. So that is what my curiosity really was, this is the reason why I had the question about hell. And also if a person has a mental disorder, is mentally unbalanced and is talking out of their head and is seeing things that are not there is this just a physical or psychological problem, or is this something that could be blamed on evilness or anything like that.

Iruka: The insanity, the problems, the mental problems experienced have physical roots. And though a person can be insane here on Urantia, these problems don't exist on the other side. They will get a chance to live with a new brain and become the person that they were meant to be. Their existence on this side may be miserable and unfulfilling but they will make up for it on the other side. Back to the question about the book, it could be any of the explanations that you cited and remember that there are things in books, written into books so they will sell. Just know how much the Father loves you and doesn't want to loose you. But if you decide not to follow Him, in many cases...you will get many chances and if you continue to decide you will cease to exist. But you will not live somewhere in horrible misery.

G3: OK, I'll let somebody else talk, but by ceasing to exist do you mean that they die or what happens when they cease to exist.

Iruka: The good things are saved and everything else disappears. The personality is lost, is gone, the potential for that individual is gone. They are no more. Does this explain?

G3: Food for thought. It helps, yes, but the ceasing to exist part I will have to think about a little more but you have helped, thanks.

Iruka: There is no pain, there is no consciousness. Maybe that word would be better. There is no awareness, there is nothing, its gone. No pain, no nothing.

Free will

S2: Iruka, I have a friend who channels, which is to me similar to TRing. She channels for a variety of spirits, angels, one's name is Seth. Seth has appeared in many books and has channeled through many people. I am wondering if you could comment on Seth as a spiritual creature and if there are any others like him that came before you. Perhaps they are teachers?

Iruka: One of the things that I cannot talk about are happenings or the reality or not the reality of happenings outside of this mission. I can talk about this mission, but I cannot comment on anything else. I am sorry.

S2: Is the reason for this, the violation of our free will, of our discovery of these entities?

Iruka: That plays a small part and there are other reasons also. This is part of a bigger picture, yes.

S2: The challenge in my life and one particular in my life is to contrast your teachings with these others that have occurred in the past. Talking with my Dad about this he says that...well I can't remember exactly what he says, but the formulation I'm walking around in my mind with and I would like to check to see if this is healthy is that too often in these other events or however we are going to describe them, people lose themselves in trying to predict the future. Don't focus on the Father, wrap themselves up in the...this non-spiritual, nonphysical, exercise that divorces them from their true tasks, their true calling here. Is that a rationale that is good to live with?

Iruka: Again, I cannot comment on that. Know that the Father loves you, you pray over these matters and make your own judgements, and come to your conclusions. Just know you are loved and you are given the freedom to explore all avenues and then make your choices. [thanks]


G2: Hello Iruka, two questions, number one we have mutual friends G3 and I, and I was debating on introducing them to the group. It seemed that the course that they are on is spiritually sound and I didn't want to either cause doubt in the course that they were going or jeopardize our friendship. Basically I felt that when they were lecturing us and we were lecturing them on different aspects, we were basically preaching to the choir. How do you know when somebody is ready to be introduced to the group.

Iruka: You just listen for the leading of your Thought Adjuster and go from there. You may not be able to tell, but that is how so many people have been introduced is a friend took a chance. The best thing I can say to you is don't let your relationship hinge on their accepting this group. Don't let them feel judged either way. Give them the freedom that the Father gives you. Love them unconditionally and let them make their own choices. This is something all humans love to have their own choice, non- judgmental, and unconditional love. But it is also so hard to turn around and give it to someone else. So when you feel, feel led, or you feel it is right, go ahead but remember if they back away, if they reject it they are not rejecting you and G3. Try to keep that separate, so it doesn't jeopardize the friendship. Your friendship will say more to them than anything else at this point. They will see your love and be drawn in. Does this help?

Teacher Contact

G2: Yes it helps a lot. Another question. I was trying to talk to my teacher last night, are you aware of this?

Iruka: I was here. I have been here since everyone has been gathering and yes your teacher...I know your teacher and so I was aware that you are making small steps and reaching out to your teacher. Your teacher is very thrilled that you are trying to make contact with him. He is very excited, you have done very well. Just keep trying, relax, don't get nervous and it will be fine. Does this answer?

G2: Yes, but I take it your are not going to comment on the quality of what the session was last night.

Iruka: The quality for one of your first contacts was wonderful. You are making small baby steps, think of the praise you give a small child for these baby steps so he keeps trying. Do not be judgmental on yourself, it takes time and it takes practice. You are doing very, very well. Does this help?

J1: Hi Iruka, when you were talking to S2 earlier, he was asking questions about channelling and some other things and you declined to answer. And in the past you have declined to answer those type of questions. And I'm not going to ask you to answer the questions but I would be curious if you could at least tell us some of the factors that weigh in not answering those questions.

Iruka: Basically it is the crossing of the will. It might influence your attitude on others who are also seeking. We give into this human thing of I'm right you are wrong and that is not the case. Everyone is searching. Does this help?

J1: Then you are saying that it is primarily a will issue? [absolutely] Food for thought. [yes]


G2: Hello Iruka, G3 was wanting to...or she says she has the gift of healing. And I was just wondering, I guess she should be wondering, but I still wonder for her. Has she established that and if not, she expressed her interest to me, that she wanted it. How could she go about developing it.

Iruka: In her quiet time with the Father, to ask the Father, tell the Father she would like to do this. Then she would be assigned a helper, a Life Carrier. There would be certain adjustments that would make sending the power through her easier. So when she laid hands on another, she could be an open conduit of this power. She can of course do it now, but when these channels are opened up, she would be more effective. The power would come through (in) stronger doses and be more effective. It takes several weeks, but that is what you should do. Anyone who wishes to do this may ask the Father and become a healer. Anyone who has this desire, the Father would certainly say yes. Does this help?

G2: Yes, but also with that desire, does there have to be a need? In my day to day life I don't see that need for me to become a healer. What kind of criteria, is there a criteria for need also, or does God put certain circumstances in your life after you become a healer to use your skills?

Iruka: Yes that happens. The need is everywhere, there are hurting, sick people all around. And once you have started helping your friends, or your families, the word will get out and someone will bring a friend or invite you to a meeting. This sort of thing. And it starts to happen. God will bring the people in who need the healing power. That is not something you have to worry about. Does this help?

G2: It helps a lot. One more personal question. Is my teacher a male or a female?

Iruka: Your teacher is a male.

G2: I'm not going to ask the name right now because I know it puts a lot of stress on the T/R, but I assume that I didn't get it right last night.

Iruka: The T/R and I will work on it and when she gets it right she will tell you. How is that. [OK]

Spontaneous Human Combustion, Fusion

S2: Iruka, in the Urantia Book where it is describing a planet that is in Light and Life, they have these temples where people go, they don't die, but they transcend, I forget the exact word. But their bodies catch on fire and sometimes they catch on fire up in the atmosphere like a flare. It describes this in the Urantia Book and I read this in high school and one day I was watching or reading a documentary on spontaneous combustion which is a phenomenon that occurs. What was very interesting about this documentary was that most of these people that caught on fire were older people that were very much loved by their community and by their families. And most of these spontaneous combustion occurred sitting on a porch rocking and nothing else really caught on fire except for maybe a little scorch in their clothes. There was just a pile of ashes left over. Are those two things connected, the spontaneous combustion phenomena here and the description in the Urantia Book on a world of Light and Life?

Iruka: Yes they are connected. That is essentially what happens. When you fuse with your Thought Adjuster, first the human has certain electro-chemical forces in their body and then the Thought Adjuster is a little piece of God with the power, with the intensity is the best word I can find. When they fuse, it ignites. Relatively few people from this planet have fused with their Thought Adjuster, but as more and more people start to search for the Father and grow to become like Him, it will start happening more and more. These people you said yourself are loved by their friends and family and they had a great love back for them and for the Father. Does this help?

S2: Yes that is exciting, thanks.

G3: Iruka, I am really confused now. When you fuse with your Thought Adjuster is that...I assume that is supposed to be something good and not something bad. When you burn up in a fire? I don't understand this, could you explain that it is supposed to be a positive thing or is this some kind of negative reaction and should we be looking forward to burning up.

Iruka: Yes, and I just told you that hell did not exist. [laughter] Yes, this is something good and positive. And it does not hurt you, it is probably shocking to someone near you but to you it is the ultimate of fusing with the Father fragment and becoming one being. Then you can have true communication, true giving and taking and becoming one. It is not meant to be frightening. You have read about the seven circles that you are..as you go closer to the center to become closer and closer to the Father to learn to do His will, to learn to show love, to become like Him. On a planet of Light and Life there are indeed buildings that people go to and this is a celebration, this is a big party. This is joyous, this is like a wedding is here. Much gaiety and happiness, it is a goal that the person is finally close to achieving. And so all the friends and family gather. There is of course sadness as there would be a person who is moving away, but overall there is much joy and happiness, and yes it is a goal. Does this help?

G3: Yes, so does that mean that we will all eventually start disappearing in this group? And that...could that explain disappearances of certain people who were not necessarily known to be murdered or dead but for some reason they just seemed to disappear from the face of the earth. I wonder if that could have happened to some people here on earth.

Iruka: Very few, no very few situations. They were mostly found in their homes, in their yards. It wasn't a case of being lost. What I mean their clothes, their belongings were found. So, no in answer to your question would this explain the disappearances, no in very few cases, no it wouldn't. Does this help? [yes]

S2: Iruka, as you progress and you grow closer to the Father inside of you, it is not absolutely necessary that you choose to go to the Morontia existence. It might even be the Father's will that you stay here on earth and teach or minister or..is this true? You don't always when you fuse with the Thought Adjuster, you don't always go up in flames, is that true? I mean I don't know.

Iruka: After you fuse you are no longer a material creature so you could not stay here. If you are to become a teacher or to do whatever work you have to stay here, you would not fuse.

Healing, Fetal Alcohol Syndrome

S1: Iruka, couple of healing questions. One of the reasons why I requested healing capabilities is because my heart was moved by some children I know who were abused and are what we call fetal alcohol syndrome children. Which is a terrible thing that's happening in our society when gals are getting pregnant and just drinking very, very heavily and the children bear this particular illness which makes them very hard to control and there is also other things related to similar drug addictions. Will healing, the healing capability that I have asked for be able to help me help these children, will they ever be normal. Is there anything that can be done for them? Because I am told there is nothing that can be done that we know such as the state of medical science now. There is nothing that can be done for them, at least that is what I have been told. So is there anything that I could do with healing capability of a Life Carrier.

Iruka: First of all remember that with the Father, anything is possible. Do not limit Him. OK with that said, praying over these children can certainly improve things. I can see that your goal is to have them absolutely healed, absolutely perfect with no signs of any drugs or alcohol. That may not happen, it will depend from child to child. Also when you pray over someone, at any given time, their body can only absorb so much of the healing power. So you might consider going back at a later time and praying over them again. And this might be, this would be a growing, a gradual process. Everyone is different, depending on the damage, depending on many things, but try, certainly try, do not assume anything. You might be disappointed, or you might be delighted. You won't always know. So follow your instincts, follow the leading of your Life Carrier or your teacher and try. Does this help?

S1: Yes it does, but one other question, what do you mean by pray over. Is that a laying on of hands as I have heard about through other ceremonies or is it just praying for someone at the location. Could you explain this a little more.

Iruka: Yes when you pray for someone, I was referring to touching them, holding their hands, putting your hands on their shoulders, or on their head. The power goes through your hands into their body. Does this explain? So that's when I referred to the body can only absorb so much power maybe after 10-15 minutes, and then stop, and then come back at a later time and try again. Yes this is physical, this is putting your hands on them. This is why it takes a while to clear out the circuits so that the power can go through with the least amount of interference as possible. Does this help?

S1: Yes, that explains more. Is this action localized? For example, the children that I work with, or that I know, I believe the damage is done, resides, in their brains essentially. Through I believe some sort of chemical imbalance, I'm not an expert. And so therefore if someone, so in other words make that child a candidate to have me maybe put my hand on its head. What I am asking is, is the healing localized in the person where I place the hands. So if I place my hand on his hand, does that mean that this effort is diminished some because it has to traverse all the way up the arm up to the head. I am trying to visualize this and am I correct in assuming that it is localized?

Iruka: Somewhat, let me explain. If you know they have a tumor in their head, or problems in their head and they would allow you to put your hands on their head, then do so. But it will still heal if you simply hold their hands with your hands, or hold their feet. It depends what kind of shape they are in. If the child will let you touch him, or if he is hyper, or will let you hold his hand, or if he is laying down and you can only hold his feet, it will go through the whole body, the power will get to the source of the problem. And actually having this power flood through the whole body makes the whole body feel better. Of course if you have your hand on their head the power will go down through their body from the head. It is an individual situation, everyone will be different. Use your best judgement. Does this explain?

S1: Yes it gives me an idea how to approach it, how to visualize the healing effect. Sort of like a wave or a wave front something traveling through the body. One other question, when we pray for someone, I don't..praying...I'm not sure how I would be able to pray for 15 minutes, would this be over one particular item? I mean I could pray fervently but I don't know if I could pray fervently for 15 minutes over one thing, specifically the healing of someone. Are there any suggestions you have as how, what format I might go or how I might approach this?

Iruka: Yes, certainly. Ask the person to get into a comfortable position. Whether he is sitting on the floor or on a couch or if he is in bed, if he is lying down in the hospital. Talk to him, tell him that you are going to pray over him, you're going to hold his hand, going to hold his feet, whatever you are going to do. Your are going to put your hands on his head. Your actual prayer need only be a few moments, just ask the Father to heal this person. To help you relax and be open, so the power may flow through you. Once you are finished, you can speak quietly with the person, you can lead them through a meditation, a relaxation meditation where when they start feeling bad they learn to relax and reach for the Father themselves. The same thing you do when you are in your meditation. Teach people how they can reach the Father themselves. You can talk quietly, the person can fall asleep. It is not necessary to pray for fifteen minutes....or just talking quietly. Does this help?

S1: Yes, if I understood you correctly, part of it is praying fervently, or praying for them and the laying on of hands where someone can contact each other, people can contact one another. And then another aspect of it is helping the person being healed to relax and to achieve a meditative state where they can seek the Father as well and that will help their healing also.

Iruka: Yes, now some individuals will not be open to this, so don't push it. So you might talk with them quietly, but staying still and staying relaxed will allow the power to flow. Does this help?

S1: Yes it does.

Iruka: It is going to be different each time. There are going to be certain individuals who will be open to certain things and others will not. Do not cross their will, show them love, just meet them where they are and don't judge them. So each time will be very different, you will have to just play it by ear. OK? [yes,thank you]

J2: Iruka, how are you? I'd like to ask several questions about healing. Is it necessary to actually touch and also about self-healing, could you give me some information on that please?

Iruka: Certainly, if you wish to be a healer and you are assigned a Life Carrier touching is the best way to get the power through you to the person. That was your first question. Certainly laying hands on yourself also works. It can be very effective. P1 has done it on herself many times when she has been feeling bad. Now you can pray for a person who is not in your vicinity, you are in your home and they are in their home, and that also will help. But it doesn't have the power of laying your hands on someone else's shoulder or holding their hands. Does this help?

J2: Yes, thank you.

E1: Hi Iruka, in terms of healing and not to get into P1's personal life, I understand she is going for surgery. Why would it not be that you would suggest to her something other than surgery or is it possible to do that.

Iruka: She asked the same question. Her surgery is more mechanical. There is no disease to be healed, things are out of order so to speak. And your modern medicine can take care of this just fine. I have no apprehensions about this surgery, it will go fine. If there was disease, then yes. Praying and laying on hands would be appropriate. Does this help?

E1: Not really, because...OK being that it is mechanical wouldn't that be easier for the spiritual beings to heal just as much as something that is diseased?

Iruka: This is an area that I am not well versed in. Since Urantia doctors and hospitals can take care of this problem, without a lot of trouble that is what we do. This does not answer your question but I am not sure why there are certain lines drawn where they are.

E1: So for example, if someone, if Iruka wasn't present and P1 had this condition and she prayed over it, not allowing surgery to intervene could she be healed?

Iruka: The situation would improve, but things would not go back to where they should be. Does this help?

E1: Not to prolong things, but no. Because you indicated before with God all things are possible, you have to elaborate a little bit more.

Iruka: This also of course is a decision that P1 made. I don't think that I can give you an adequate answer, I'm sorry.

G3: Iruka, maybe I can ask a question that will help E1's question, if you can...OK this is an example. So far as healing is concerned, if someone had a brain tumor that could be operated on as opposed to someone praying for the brain tumor to be dissolved or whatever. I would assume that surgery would probably be a lot faster then and maybe could also help the person life to..would also help the person to quicker assume their daily functions, through surgery, opposed to the fact that a person could be prayed for, but the tumor would have to shrink probably and would probably take so long, the person would still be in pain for so long. I mean God can or could I'm sure shrink the tumor but is this an example, surgery opposed to someone who should get surgery opposed to someone who should have someone lay hands on them. Is this a good example of what you are referring to?

Iruka: Possibly, but in that situation both should be considered and both done. Some diseases will be healed instantly and some are not. There are many variables that play into this. I would both pray over that person and schedule surgery. It just depends on the situation. This is hard, it is a hard topic and there is no one way to do anything. You have many options, it is difficult.

G3: OK, by all means I will definitely pray for the person also. Does the laying on of hands, if you have the gift of healing or you have a Life Carrier who has given you, who is helping you with this, would that also help for someone who had a mental disorder. If you had the gift of healing would that also, could that possibly heal someone who is mentally unbalanced?

Iruka: That is always possible. But the variables that dictate whether someone is actually healed are many. The person's attitude, and how he perceives himself and how he perceives himself getting well. This is a question that we still struggle on this side with. We don't know at this level at all yet, we don't understand everything, but we do know it is important to try. Does this help, maybe a little?

G3: Yes, this helps a lot, especially when you were explaining earlier about, or just now, that different people respond differently to prayer because I have many times prayed for my father who has been in many...he seems to get himself into one bad situation after the other..and he has been in the hospital I don't know how many times. A lot of times, when he was in the hospital he was in there for serious, very serious things, and each time he would request that I would pray for him. And in some cases, almost immediately he was healed like the next day maybe he would be released from the hospital and he would go home and at other times when he was recently hospitalized for a severe car crash and he suffered internal injuries, brain damage, he was also miraculously recovered. I know other people have been praying for him too but for some reason I felt when I laid my hands on him and prayed...after about, I did pray over, and over, and over whether this one particular time, I prayed maybe I don't know how many times, every other day or every day I would go to the hospital and lay on hands on him and pray for him. His injuries were medically, the doctors said he may...he could have died and he may not ever recover. Right now mentally he is almost 85% back to where he was before the accident, and he is steadily recovering and physically he is 95% back to where he was before the accident. On the other hand I pray for my mother's eyesight where she has diabetes and her eyesight has been affected. I see an improvement in her but it is so minimal till I can't...you know . .the two people, I would expect her to be healed quicker than my father because she believes so strongly in the power of God but I have only prayed for her once or twice whereas I prayed for my father many, many times so maybe that also has to do with why she is not completely healed or her eyesight is not better than it is. I don't know, if that is a comment or a question. But that is what I wanted to say about that, if you wanted to comment on that feel free.

Iruka: Thank you for sharing and that really indicates how all the variables can work. That is a very good example, thank you.


M1: Hello Iruka, I was wondering if you could explain how one can tell whether they are being guided by their spirit or guided by their intellect, and part of the reason I ask this question is because you had mentioned that human's get into this I'm right you're wrong thing. And I've read some things in the Urantia Book that I feel are right and I've talked with other people who have read the Bible and they say they are right. One point in fact is the question of Christ dying for our sins. I know the people who believe that Christ died for our sins are not sure whether they believe this because their spirit has guided them to that belief or it is something that they believe because of reading it and translating it into their mind, which is guiding them to believing things that may be incorrect.

Iruka: When you attend church, you listen to the minister and you hear and accept what he says. And sometimes even if it doesn't sound right, if you have been going to church since you were five years old and you keep hearing it, it becomes true. Just because everybody keeps saying it. And so it is not necessarily that their inner spirit has told them this, it's that everybody on the outside has told them this. If you are listening to everyone on the outside, it is hard to hear the spirit on the inside. It depends on where you are focused. And of course, it's a guess on why somebody believes why they believe. But love these people, show them courtesy, whatever they believe. Does this help?


M1: Yes, it helps and I have had conversations and confrontations with people who don't believe certain things that I believe. I guess I, for some reason, feel that I want them to at least try to understand some of the things that I believe but it gets difficult at times and I guess when there is times when I could discuss certain things of Urantia teachings that I believe sometimes I just leave it alone to avoid a confrontation, and I'm wondering is that the correct way to go about this?

Iruka: Usually a confrontation doesn't really change anyone's mind. But take the example of Christ Michael, when he lived here he approached people and talked with them, usually by asking a general question about God. And what he tried to do was tell them truths, and not attack what they had wrong or what they believed that was wrong. Because the truth will soon force out the error. So find a place that you can agree on, find a topic that you both agree, and move out from there. And don't worry about the error, their own Thought Adjuster will take care of them. The Spirit of Truth will take care of them. And they might not listen to you, where they might listen to the spirit of truth. Sometimes, people build up walls and they don't want to listen to another human because that makes you right and them wrong. And they are threatened by that. So don't worry about their error. Communicate how much God loves them and they can agree with that. And just keep the person as a friend and as they open up and trust then show them new ideas. Does this help?

M1: Yes it does, thank you.


G2: Hello Iruka, I believe last session you made reference to another session whereby I believe you said Caligastia before he left, or was dispelled, put the AIDS virus on Urantia. Is that correct?

Iruka: Yes.

G2: Is the influx in healers being assigned to humans now, a reason to combat that or is it possible?

Iruka: At this time there is no known cure, but their lives can certainly be improved. They can certainly have more strength and feel better and live more, live better. So it would not be a waste to spend time in trying to heal them. Does this help?

G2: Yes, it does help a little bit. I was just concerned because knowing that he put something on the earth like that right before he left. So I will take it that on the other side they are working feverishly to find a solution to this problem too.

Iruka: Yes, you are right, they are.

G2: And what happens to the person's soul once they cross over. Is that contaminated also?

Iruka: When they cross over, you mean when they die?

G2: Yes, is their soul hurt?

Iruka: No, this is physical, this is a physical disease that stays with the body, does not survive.

G2: I presume as soon as spiritually they find a cure for it that they will transmit to the healers or they will show the doctors the way to find the cure for the disease.

Iruka: Both, there are people, humans, doing research and they will be given the answer, will be guided to find the answer as soon as the researchers on my side have the answer. Does this explain?

G2: Yes it explains a lot, thank you very much.

S1: In following up to G2's question, would we ourselves be able to appeal to, to find people who are suffering from communicable diseases and diseases like AIDS. Would we be at risk by seeking healing for someone like that or would we...being that we have healing capabilities would we be more immune to something like that.

Iruka: Good question, you take the necessary precautions even though you are exposed to healing power more than the average person. But you be just as careful as you would at any other time for the various diseases. If you had to wear a mask for instance to walk into a certain ward a certain place you could catch something through the air, wear the mask. Proceed as if you could get those diseases. That is...use precautions because if you are not careful and you could contract them, there would be healing power available to you, but why go through all that pain. Why knock yourself out of commission when you are supposed to be the one that is passing along the power to others. So that is a good question. You take very good care of yourself in that respect. Be very cautions and do whatever it takes to protect yourself.

S1: That clears up some things. Can you tell if anyone of us are like ill or sick or coming down with a cold. Can you see, or do you have angels or entities here that can tell if one of us is coming down with something?

Iruka: Not usually. Germs, viruses, are very small and while my vision is much more than yours, I still cannot see little viruses or germs. I cannot detect cells that are wrong, that are growing wrong. Does this help?

S1: Yes, I understand. I just felt a little strange this past couple of days, like I may have been sliding into a cold and maybe I shouldn't, I just realized I shouldn't be sitting next to G3 who is with child. Obviously you couldn't tell me whether that was a real threat right now could you?

Iruka: Cold germs are usually always in the air. And when your system is down, is not well protected you are susceptible. But to worry that you are sitting next to someone who could get that from you, when she could pick it up from anywhere, that should not be a concern in that way. Do you understand? But you need to take better care of yourself and get more sleep.

If there are no more questions for this evening, I will close. One more? OK.

S2: Iruka, I have had this knot on my forehead for since I can remember. This knot is...I don't know if it is spiritual or not. I noticed it before I ever read the Urantia Book. In the Urantia Book I equated my knot with something wrong, or something undesirable, or some clue as to whether I am going forward or backwards. And I read about...in the Garden of Eden, how the beings there, their foreheads glowed a little bit, or radiated somehow. And at certain times this knot disappears and then as I grew up I watched...especially pregnant women, their faces seemed to glow. I have been able to detect that and last meeting G3 was complaining about her complexion or something and I said no there is nothing wrong it is glowing. I didn't even know she was pregnant. And I was wondering if this is just a creation of my mind, all this stuff about foreheads, knots on my forehead, or whether its really something spiritual going on.

Iruka: There are indeed what you call auras around people. But most people cannot see them. Others have detected them and learned to see them, see them and know they are there. Not everyone can, but yes they are real. Was that your question?

S2: Is the negative knot on my forehead real?

Iruka: The knot has nothing to do with your spirituality. Is this what you are asking?

S2: Yes. It is not a physical knot. My seven year old daughter was staring at me two days ago and I said what are you looking at and she said your forehead. And at that point I was feeling the knot. Is there some connection going on? I don't talk about this with anybody else so she could not even know about it.

Iruka: She is obviously seeing this glow, this aura around you. And you feel this and you describe it as a knot? I am not aware of this phenomena, that you can feel your aura. Do I understand this right?

S2: Maybe I am feeling the absence of an aura, or maybe I am...this is enough of the conversation. I am lost as it is.

Iruka: Remember with God anything is possible, but I am not aware of what you are referring to, I am sorry.


If there are no more questions, we will close for today. I enjoy these times when we get together, I look forward to them and I will miss you. You have a good week and show love to everyone you can. Good Evening.

Group: Good Evening.