Talk:2013-01-13-N. Idaho TeaM
Discussion of Eisenhower
January 18, 2013
Spirit4ya (John Kimble) wrote:Fri, Jan 18, 2013 at 3:30 PM
Eisenhower ?????? What the....! When Ron Besser, channelled Eisenhower, he was wrote off as being crazy.
What say you about this Gerdean?
I thought the UB says mortals cannot communicate with us within the dispensation in which they lived.
Of course, we have had a few dispensations since Eisenhower graduated, but this is NOT in the UB!!! This is NEW unwritten Revelation or rather "Living" updated Revelation.
If it's not in the UB, it's not true - right? Are Mark and Cathy making the same mistake as Ron? No Way!! it's not possible.
So, what are we to do with this, believe or not believe? This time, it did not come through Ron's far-out Imagination.
Ha ha, I Love It!! Let's see how TML handles this one. I have a feeling 2013, will be a very interesting year indeed. lol
So, as we say in Chess, "your move" Gerdean and Steffani.
Always with Brotherly love.
STuTe
Gerdean wrote: Fri, Jan 18, 2013 at 4:25 PM
It all depends, STuTe, on whether you bow to Mr. Besser's authority and consider December 30 to be the official day of the new dispensation. If that is the case, then it would be acceptable to contact anyone from a previous dispensation, such as Eisenhower, George Washington, Thomas Jefferson, Gurdjief, Paramahansa Yogananda, Judas, even Rick Giles as Jonathan. On the other hand, if you believe, as I do, that Mr. Besser is talking out of the other side of his hat, all these amusing, sentimental, anecdotal, and/or history-laden messages are better termed "creative license" which, to me, in our case, closely resembles "liberty without license" -- a characteristic of the Lucifer legacy.
But no, STuTe, we have not had "a few dispensations since Eisenhower graduated" -- not as I understand dispensations, which occur on an evolving world only once every several thousand years, and a dispensation lasts from 25,000 to 50,000 years or more.
Ron Besser wrote:Fri, Jan 18, 2013 at 4:38 PM
Awe and Eisenhower,
I can not tell you how happy I am that Eisenhower was allowed to speak through another. While I am completely aware that I have few principles involved in seeking advice from persons like Eisenhower, I do adore the abilities of those who know enough, feel capable enough, to open their minds and their transmissions to the untraditional contact. It is in these unexpected and out-of-norm contacts which so greatly deepen the understanding of what Urantia is about and what it is like as seen from a distance we do not yet feel is available to us.
Eisenhower is ready to speak to anyone who dares to accept they are better than we have allowed ourselves to be. We, meaning myself and Eisenhower who is here with me as I write this, wish all to carry their sword of promise to others and not allow it lay fallow in the weeds of deplorable fear that you or your partner feels must attest to being allowed to speak for the greats of history and about the deeds they prospered with or fell into oblivion by.
Those of you who fault me or fault North Idaho or those who see further than you can, must take leave of your awe for everything supernatural unless it is sanctioned by the Urantia Book. In many respects the Urantia Book is playing the foil to your progress. Wake up! You are so much more than you allow yourselves!
From the beginning of the Teaching Mission it struck me as an indicator that it will be used as a destroyer of the punishment of what awe does to the will to act in the presence of greatness. My friend Jonathon is making you listen to what you insist is impossible, but the will of God negates your unreasonable attitudes that the law is in the Urantia Book while living spirit has moved on with the change decreed by the Universal Father himself. Jonathan, Eisenhower, Roosevelt, Oppenheimer, Dante, and a great many others now speak to the world through the instrumentation you all possess but guard with such jealousy it never gets used!
While I re-assemble myself to be heard on other subjects in the new year, I am hoping against hope that some of you long timers begin to reassess your stand as to where you will take your courage and your talent and give voice to the new age that is now upon us. All of you understand too little to complain about those who would point it out to you, but all the while, you are subject to the paradigm that has been substituted for what has been for what is now.
God Bless North Idaho for standing tall and speaking to the host of newcomers to the lectures of history that will be upon us in a few short months!
Ron Besser
Rob wrote: Fri, Jan 18, 2013 at 5:31 PM
What minds attribute mindless mechanisms with authority?
- re: :On Fri, Jan 18, 2013 at 3:30 PM, Spirit4ya <spirit4ya@yahoo.com> wrote:
- Let's see how TML handles this one
Rob wrote:Fri, Jan 18, 2013 at 5:40 PM
Hello Ron-
Glad to see you again, and welcome! Of course, the reliance upon external authority is not so much a fallacy as it is an indication of reliance upon the visible to verify the invisible. To the extent this exists for any is the measure of their relative degree of personal attunement. When all is said and done, each individual is responsible for discerning what is of value regardless of attributions, human or divine. To that end, discussions of such questions will be recorded in the talkpage of any lesson.
Gratefully,
Rob
Oliver Deux wrote: Fri, Jan 18, 2013 at 7:16 PM
Dear STuTe
The style of your provocation hit me as to be resembling to what an aficionado of a spectator sport would say.
Discernment is something that needs to be practiced regularly and lends itself readily to personal value manifestations. It is definitely very personal, and thusly unique.
The most important values clearly come from Jesus himself. He said, "...And so send I you abroad to preach this salvation of sonship. Salvation is the free gift of God, but those who are born of the spirit will immediately begin to show forth the fruits of the spirit in loving service to their fellow creatures. And the fruits of the divine spirit which are yielded in the lives of spirit-born and God-knowing mortals are: loving service, unselfish devotion, courageous loyalty, sincere fairness, enlightened honesty, undying hope, confiding trust, merciful ministry, unfailing goodness, forgiving tolerance, and enduring peace." (2054.3) 193:2.2
Discernment can have at its root a courageous loyalty to the values and meaning that have allowed a person to grow spiritually. Can you imagine a time where all interested in the Teaching Mission also studied The Urantia Book? When you said, "I thought the UB says..." it really only reflects on you and your values concerning an epochal revelation that I still recommend to invest as much time with as humanly possible.
All else, ALL ELSE, is at best a co-creation between a human mind and what it allows to filter through its built-in filters. And the human mind is always involved. Daniel prooved this the other day when he listened in to what was being said, and adviced the questioner that the teacher had already answered well enough. The transcriber then continue to point out how really different Daniel's syntax was from that of the channeled teacher, as further proof for Daniel's authenticity. Who needs to be convinced? And the teacher, how very human, allegedly confirmed that Daniel gets it all the worlds right. How convenient it is for the ego to pad itself on its back. A celestial teacher will hardly feed human ego dramas. Basic human phsycholgy, well understood by any teacher worth his or her salt. (And why are there more male teachers than female, when all the world knows that unless the female gender is completely integrated in culture and society and leadership positions, the males will continue to spread teresterone-based thinking, which got us where we are?)
The names of teachers are ever so relative. It is my experience and those of several receivers that I have exchange with and tested this premise with, that, yes, we can open ourselves to lessons, and as the mind desires to speak to a certain teacher that it can accept, that teacher will be there -- no matter what the name is. The celestial downpour will feed into every human crack that opens up. My mind has a whole list of personalities it wants to avoid because I am human and I have my prejudices and personal values, which are not always spirit values. I can only perpetually yearn for the latter to manifest increasingly in my life. I can pray that I get help to manifest them each day more.
New teacher names are often difficult to understand. We have tried spelling, and a co-R/T and I received different spellings. My spirit name was equally difficult to get right. So was it with the Melchizdek Ahmoran, who first was A-moran -- no kidding.
Discernment can grow when you study the revelation and also recall what you recall from hundreds of transmissions you read over time. You look for unfailing consistency. What sticks out too far is very probably mind generated. I think that Churchill was the most advanced leader of his time and not Eisenhower. After Stalin's death Churchill wanted the recently elected president Eisenhower to open towards the Soviet Union. Eisenhower's mentor, John Forster Dulles, opposed that. Going at the present rate, it is only a question of time before we hear from Dulles and Stalin, even Hitler, because questioning minds just want to know what happened to these minds that influenced and killed so many. And why Eisenhower? Was he living the fruits of the spirit then, or was he retrained in the few years since? All that stuff is not the Teaching Mission that I subscribed to, not at all.
Was my mind focused and inclined to speak with personalities that live as close to the Universal Father as we know, and then a bit later talk to historic figures, as Ron has demonstrated, I definitely would have picked Churchill. You see how personal this gets when you set yourself up as a leader in receiving alledged messages from former mortals, who had just a few years, or in the case of brother Jonathan, months to become a teacher. The message will sound okay as long as the spirit values and their fruits are expressed. I am discerningly convinced that teachers could care less if we get names right, or make up phantasy names, as long as spiritual fruits are fed to a planet that is in such desperation for light and life.
Oliver
John Kimble (Stute) wrote:Fri, Jan 18, 2013 at 8:03 PM
No, I bow to no "human" authority, as I SEE the T/Ring process as new and experimental. Until we "perfect" the T/Ring process, which could take many generations, in my view, I will always take Ron's stuff and even your transmissions Gerdean, with a grain of salt, slanted, especially since you represent the opposite extreme on the Monjoronson issue. It would really be GREAT if you would "OPEN" to Monjoronson so TML will balanced. Especially, since so many others T/Rs already transmit his messages.
While many believe and transmit Monjoronson, not just Ron, even you once; your insistence that Monjoronson is a "widget" and does not exist, keeps me from bowing to your authority. I SEE you as the extreme opposite of Ron. The fact is Gerdean, because you are "closed minded" to Monjoronson, this prevents you from receiving him. That's pretty obvious from where I sit. For me, I always seek the middle ground where ALL things are possible and where God is a "Living" God and not frozen between the pages of a book.
Outside of the UB, we have in the past received "Living" updated transmissions, not just from Ron, stating that this planet has already experienced "special" dispensations. But, since that info is not in the UB, IT DID NOT HAPPEN. Ridiculous!! Deep critical thinking and the fact that this planet is not frozen in time, reveals the Truth of this.
It's amazing to me how the world stopped turning or growing in experienced and activity since the UB was printed. EVERYTHING STOPPED!!! Even the activities of the Spirit Beings STOPPED. All spirit beings and activities are frozen in time until a new UB is delivered. RIDICULOUS!! Man! I wish they would hurry up and give us another UB so we can get some updated information just to satisfy you, as that's the ONLY way to get it.
Until that happens, the UB fundamentalist, the extreme conservatives on this site, will continue to claim transmitting "Eisenhower" and others of that era IS NOT POSSIBLE.
A Closed Mind is dangerous.
STuTe
January 19, 2013
Tom Newbill wrote: Sat, Jan 19, 2013 at 4:02 AM
When transcribing I rarely add group comments, however after Eisenhower spoke several thanked him...Mark Turnbull playfully chimed in ...."my dad voted for you."--rdavis 15:58, 19 January 2013 (UTC)
Rob wrote: Sat, Jan 19, 2013 at 10:02 AM
thank you Tom! As you may have discerned, I think the comments of Teaching Mission participants is as revealing as the lessons, perhaps even more so. However, in the Nordan Symposia, they appear in a separate talkpage into which I have added your note. Tell Mark, my dad voted for him too! ;-)
