Talk:2013-08-31-New Era Conversations 7

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Lighterstill.jpg WARNING: Readers should be apprised of conflicting assessments of the document 2013-08-31-New Era Conversations 7 that cast doubt upon the integrity of the entire corpus emanating from its source.


USA Moral Upholder?

Rob wrote: September 3, 2013 at 6:42pm to Dave Tenney, cc'ing Byron Belitsos, Marty Greenhut, Mer Tenney, and Rick Voss. Also sent this to Oliver Deux and Gerdean.

In this lesson, it appears "the Triumvirate" has come down on the side of the NeoCon agenda citing the US government as "moral upholder" for the world against the Syrian government described as corrupt by contrast. This suggests a moral imperative for use of unilateral military action without having presented any evidence of who the guilty party is in the recent use of chemical weapons amidst so much conflicting information. One might have hoped that a more sane position would be forthcoming from a "higher intelligence" such as encouraging an independent investigation whose findings could be referred to the Security Council who might ask the ICC to assign a sentence upon the guilty. Disappointing to say the least.

Would you like to register your opinion in the discussion page?--rdavis 23:38, 3 September 2013 (UTC)

September 3

Gerdean wrote: September 3, 2013 at 8:29pm

I would not take too seriously any counsel from anyone who thinks Central America is a continent.

Oliver wrote: September 3, 2013 at 10:14pm

Dear Gerdean and Rob:

I wish I could make the time to comment on all aspects that do and do not confirm my experiences and understanding of planetary issues.

While I concur that such a blatant error that renders just another doomsday transmission less believable, I am often impressed by you guys' astuteness and your attention to detail.

Indeed, Central America, when applying our Urantia's unified continental model, is merely a sub-continent of the North American Continent.

But the transmission is riddled with incomplete thoughts and objectionable conclusions. I wish I had the time to comment in detail.

For instance, the supernals "condone" the elimination of socially unsustainable dictators, although they are not in favor of violence and war.

Watching Al Jazeera more than any other news organization, I have found a journalistic professionalism and unbiased reporting that I can't imagine humans can do any better. The US, still embarrassed by the Bush administration's lies as a reason to take out a dictator, is solely taking about punishment. A dictator who kills his own with nerve gas, will not hesitate to gas his perceived enemies.

This matter needs NOT be handled by the US alone, and I am glad that Barrack is much more careful than the under-qualified Bush was. It pleases me that a public discussion is taking place. I am convinced that the elimination of the Syrian regime will not bring peace, but instead start a civil war where the forces sworn to destroy the West will be inspired to fight for control.

But teacher Charles is correct when pointing out that these teaching —he seems to be indicating that they have happened for far longer than what we have documented— are not catching on fast enough to avoid doomsday. Most of us —me included— are not prepared when the world's supply lanes and international travel gets disrupted. I presently do not maintain an organic garden, but would I want to defend it when my neighbors go hungry?

Just today the bat > virus story was collaborated: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-23932400

Sorry, sibs, I am not just menopausal when I say that I anytime prefer listening to positive contemporaries such as doc Larry Brilliant than to the Charles and Dan team. Check out this video before you go to sleep tonight: https://www.ted.com/talks/larry_brilliant_wants_to_stop_pandemics.html

If you are on a role, here is another great one: https://www.ted.com/talks/larry_brilliant_makes_the_case_for_optimism.html

Good night. Let's review the day: what have we learnt that we can do better tomorrow.

Oliver

Rob wrote: September 3, 2013 at 9:21pm

Thanks Oliver! Would you like me to insert your comments in the discussion page or keep them private? Regardless, I appreciate you sharing your thoughts. It encourages me to witness careful scrutiny of statements cloaked in authority.

Oliver wrote: September 3, 2013 at 10:38pm

But you encouraged me first. I would not have read this transmission without you addressing me.

If you think my comments are of value, please correct the English and change to this sentence: I wish I could make the time to comment on all aspects that do and do not confirm my experiences and understanding of planetary issues.

I also would like to see your original notes from 6:42 PM included as well.

To me the discussion page is an alternative to tml and ctc. I seem to not be able to make the time to get involved in discussions there these days.

O.

September 4

Rob wrote: September 4, 2013 at 11:16am

Thanks Oliver! I will do as you suggested. The discussion page is for independent opinions to be registered without concerns for controlling the Teaching Mission, Magisterial Mission, or Correcting Time. Tml, Ctc, etc. tends to get bogged down in attempts to control. I am more interested in fostering the comparative and critical studies of 'revelatory' literature.

Rob wrote: September 4, 2013 at 2:59pm

Several persons whose opinions were invited replied expressing doubt about the validity of this document, but all of these requested their comments to be withheld from public view. All others simply avoided any reply.

Gerdean wrote: September 4, 2013 at 10:29pm (edited version of post to tml)

Snipping away the dross ....

  • The situation in Syria

"Although this will not develop into a World War, it will have all the repercussions of a World War, both with the disruption of societies, economies, political stability and social stability throughout most nations." My response is: if it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck and waddles like a duck, chances are it's a duck. Same with war. Call it what you will, such as the Korean Conflict, which never was called a war, but it had the same effect ... especially on the soldiers.

  • The destiny of the Americas

"This nation and these continents of North, Central and South America are continents of destiny." Central America is not a continent.

  • The upholder of moral action on a global scale

How can anyone consider the US to be an upholder of moral action? Not for a lonnnnnng time have we been considered "moral."

  • The Syrian government is morally corrupt

"The situation you see in the Middle East is violent, very destructive and if the intentions are correct and we can be of influence to that area, then they will become socially sustainable, developing, evolving societies." Is Charles a conservative or a liberal celestial?

  • Bringing about peace on a primitive planet like Urantia

If Syria is adjudged morally corrupt because it has gassed its own people in order to eliminate them, what about America eliminating its own people through chemtrails, endless wars (or, excuse me, bloody and endless non-wars), poisoning their food, or depriving people of medical attention? I am having a hard time determining where moral corruption takes up and where it leaves off. "Do you clearly understand our position regarding the violence being done by the dictators and by your nation?" Evidently not.

  • The unraveling of societies and economies

It seems that the violence that we are about to inflict, or will inflict upon that government is necessary to bring it into some kind of moral line to force them to the realization that moral beings do not kill their own people. CHARLES: Yes. I fail to understand how killing those who kill will teach people not to kill. Speaking of "... pandemics that will then spread uncontrollably ..." I thought our task was to spread the benign virus.

  • A moral responsibility to be part of the reconstruction

I wish you would repeat those "three core values of social sustainability" every time you make reference to them. It is evidently not yet obvious and self-evident what they are.

  • The vectors of spreading disease

not to mention dis-ease

  • The decline of societies will be very rapid

stock up on duct tape!

  • The majority of people worldwide are unprepared

That's why it is a spiritual mission! The spirit is the only way we can succeed. My God! This is dismal!

  • The need for new paradigms in politics and economics

Here they go again, telling us we need a vast decimation of the population as there are far too many people. In that case, you'd think Syrians were the smart ones, to eliminate their excess population.

  • The purpose and intentions of the Triumvirate

"Whether you are rich or poor, you are seen as a social asset to society whose quality and value can be improved with training and through education and opportunities to develop your potential to grow, to improve your quality of life." Now we're talking zooidal!

  • The lack of planetary management perspective by societies

Again ... WHAT "three values of social sustainability"? If this were the first transcript of this sort I had ever come across, I wouldn't get it because those critical words are missing.

  • The sovereignty of “all,” of “oneness”

I'm tired. I quit.

September 5

Rob wrote: September 5, 2013 at 3:21pm

This morning I remembered that Roxanne's (the transcriptionist) son (son-in-law?) is one of the most trenchant apologists for U.S. Foreign Policy working as he does for the State Department, and it occurred to me that it is possible Daniel/Monjoronson has been co-opted in desperation to disguise the moral bankruptcy of US Foreign Policy that the world sees more clearly each day. It wouldn't be the first TR to be lured by the illusion of power.

I have added the cautionary banner to the page recommending persons apprise themselves of alternative opinions, and enclose here the cautionary admonition of Ham.

In this mission, there are many who come as wolves in sheep's clothing, those who subtly change our messages to suit their own purposes and therefore hide behind a teacher. But, I tell you so, that teachers do not accept this but in each transmission, there is some human element. The teachers, however, do not exist for the promotion of individuals. They do, however, encourage individual development and there is a vast difference.

Those who begin by hiding self-promotion behind the words of the teacher usually do not remain long, but seek to grab the spotlight instead for themselves completely. But I say to you, in these cases, the teacher was withdrawn long before. There are those who seek mass movements with buildings and human hierarchies to support, but this was not the way of Jesus of Nazareth who walked the earth as a humble teacher, who did not seek worldly fame nor riches nor worldly power of any kind. - Ham

Marty Greenhut wrote: September 5, 2013 at 9:46pm

Its a very slippery slope Rob. I was reluctant to send it out as a Harp of God Bulletin However, I believe that each person has their own discernment and it is not my job. Here we are receiving transmitted messages from beyond the realm of visibility.... that is our Teaching Mission experience and this one is a Magisterial Mission communique. I have been networking news of the gas attack as from Assad's enemies from Saudi Arabia in Turkey. Now they seem to have been manufactured videos. But who knows??? Marty

Rob wrote: September 5, 2013 at 10:00pm

Hello Marty-

Thanks for sharing your thoughts! Your reluctance is reflected in my assigning the mildly cautionary banner directing persons to more critical thinking that appears in the discussion page. Fostering discernment requires tolerance for error.

Gratefully,

Rob

September 17

Rob wrote: September 17, 2013 at 7:55pm

It appears 'Monjoronson' has addressed this issue in the New Era Conversations 8, but this deserves careful attention going forward.--rdavis 00:57, 18 September 2013 (UTC)

September 26

What a contrast this lesson is to the New Era Conversations 8 (&7) where the latter expresses nothing but the public diplomacy of a deranged US Foreign Policy.--rdavis 20:32, 26 September 2013 (UTC)

October 11

Since this alarming record was created, information has begun to demonstrate the vacuity of claims attributed to an Avonal Son and his staff. See U.S. fed with bogus Intel by Israeli moles.--rdavis 02:23, 11 October 2013 (UTC)