2008-05-28-Contradictions About Reincarnation

From Nordan Symposia
Jump to navigationJump to search


Teaching buddha small.jpg


Topic: Contradictions About Reincarnation

Group: N. Idaho TeaM


Teacher: Monjoronson

TR: Jonathan



Monjoronson: [Jonathan]: It is an honor to serve Michael of Salvington and to be engaged in His plans for all His worlds to specifically.... beyond this precious planet Urantia to do the work of this spectacular Creator Son. This is Monjoronson, you may proceed.


Question #1[Mary] Hi Monjoronson, thanks for being here. Well your intro causes me to pick this question as the first to ask. This person would like to know if you could explain what your relationship is to Michael and Nebadonia and would also like to know, have you ever met and known the Universal Father as Jesus knew the Universal Father? They specify if you've known the Universal Father as distinct from knowing a thought adjuster, thank you.

Monjoronson: I am, as you understand, a Paradise Son but I am not of the same order as Michael for He is of the origin of Father/Son and I, the origin of Eternal Son/Infinite Spirit. And so I am aware of deity by way of the reflections of the Eternal Son and Infinite Spirit. I carry that signature of the three persons and when I am in the presence of a Michael Son I detect the connection of Father that every Creator Son has. By having been involved in a bestowal mission, one wherein I acted as did Michael when he was here in the form of Jesus, gave me the interface with the divine fragment, the thought adjuster.

I have been in the presence of Father on Paradise but my interface with Him is of a different order who is inherently of The Father. In Nebadon I served under Michael who is the Sovereign and ruler along with the Mother Spirit whom you know as Nebadonia. I take orders from Him and from Gabriel who is the overall administrator for what transpires in Nebadon. My mission allows me great latitude of function for I have been recognized as capable, skilled and trained to execute the mission of a Magisterial order for Michael and I am pledged to accomplish the tasks required to meet His goals for this world.

I am ever willing to adjust my approach as I seek counsel from Michael. We are intimately connected by way of His Spirit of Truth which all Avonal Sons have a resonance with a Creator Son. I consider myself a partner but a partner of a serving manner just as you would have in your physical body a dominant hand and a supporting hand which allows the dominant hand to do things with assistance. Have I addressed all aspects of your question? [Yes, I believe so, thank you Monjoronson.]

Question #2: [Mary] The next question was in the form of a very long letter so I will restate the basic nature of the question. It involves a seeming contradiction between the Urantia Book teachings about reincarnation and many peoples experiences with past lives and their experiences leading them to the reality of reincarnation and also that there are many teachings out there that do support reincarnation. This person would like you to address this apparent contradiction between the Urantia book and many different teachings on Urantia at this time as well as many peoples experiences, thank you.

Monjoronson: [Jonathan] I will address the issue from the topic of self importance. As a fledgling soul develops, begins to understand and engage in cosmic realities, not merely the realities you face in a daily life manner, there begins to dawn upon the soul an identity with spirit and this is manifested in many ways, sometimes through profound devotion of one who gives complete love and surrender over to a higher being, a master. Other times this comprehension of higher realities is managed by the personality in the form of a theological intellectualism, which while providing an intricate structure which describes those higher realities the soul is connecting with will often stall the soul in the pursuit of even more profound connection.

The soul as it develops learns of its unique place in the multitude of spirit beings but there is the tendency to project ones own personality upon experiences before one understands the dual nature of a human being. It is a simple reach of faith to conceive of and to commune with God, your divine parents, and to awaken to you're being a child of God and it is from that, easy to accept the presence of the divine spirit. But this spirit, while of God is also you and herein lies the confusion of the experiences that a soul has that are then transformed into conceptualizations you call reincarnation.

It really is of little importance, the factuality of such an experience for many souls develop [deeper] universe values from their discernment of a living episode undertaken by the divine spirit in another realm. Human beings particularly on a world such as Urantia so long under isolation ever tend to describe what is discerned of a cosmic nature in human terms. Reincarnation is merely a description from a point of view of oneself, the human self and the environs in which that self functions. Your revelation, the papers of Urantia are attempting to describe to the human mind a procedure of soul advancement which is not strictly centered within the comings and goings of a terrestrial life such as on Urantia.

When one can set aside the importance of the human self and transcend it to identify with the divine self within one fully understands that the episodes discerned in the reincarnation belong to that higher center of awareness and being and that the self is of a human orientation is merely a beneficiary of those experiences by way of reflective hindsight. There is no true contradiction for reincarnation is merely a descriptive framework for comprehending an interface with spirit, a manner by which the mind can realize and provide sanity in sorting out the experience which of often quite profound and unnerving to the human mind.

Naturally there develops religious structures surrounding such experiences just as there have over the centuries developed religious ceremony that are centered upon and revolve around some key factor that is cherished by the human beings so organizing. It could be for example, political power, sexual dominance, it could be the result of experiences that are received during states of mind that are chemically altered and then those inclined to favor such descriptions join those groups. This is how such a concept as reincarnation can become so well established.

But it all rests upon the self centered view of the human mind that says all things must be described according to myself and it is only a few souls who can bridge the gap to the high spirit that dwells within and recognize that those experiences derived from spirit and by which you are given privy are yours by gift rather than yours by experientially undertaking them. Nonetheless, regardless of those frameworks, every soul manages to discern more of spirit, to alter character by way of elevation of values, to become more of spirit oneself and this is the important development. Does this satisfy?

Question #3: [Mary] It satisfies me Monjoronson and I'm sure that if people have further questions they can state them we'll look at them so thank you for addressing that subject.

There is a question here from someone visiting the website and has been reading other teachings as well and is wondering about the teachings of the ignition of Jupiter into a second sun and the coming of planet X. This person is feeling confused about these things and asks if you could shed some light on them.

Monjoronson: I have no real interest in the development of stages in the life of planetary bodies. I am here to uplift the souls of every being who resides on this sphere. These are straws by way of curiosity in the seeking mind attempting to develop unified coherence of all activities throughout the universe. It is of little importance to the ascension of a human soul what happens to the spheres around you except for whether of not you will remain on this planet and that is of little importance in the internal scheme for you will reside upon millions, even billions of worlds before you transcend into the experience of Paradise, the center of all.

If such an occurrence as a gaseous planet transforming into a sun were to occur, it would have to be by the injection of energies from a high being who is engaged in such manipulations of physical energy for the world itself is not so situated. I will address one more side point; many predictions on your world are erroneous but they spring from a sincere hope for change and transformation to bring about conditions of a new world, of a higher way to lift mankind out of its current situation, but there is no external event or events which will transform humankind.

You each must change within yourselves. Your own sun could go dark tomorrow and that would not alter your spiritual unfoldment from the higher perspective. It would be no different than changing your shoes. You may continue.

Question #4: [Mary] Thanks Monjoronson and I appreciate the inherent guidance in your answer about the types of questions that are appropriate as far as your avenue or areas of expertise and interest and I really appreciate you addressing the underlying nature of predictions on Urantia, I personally appreciate that, thank you.

After your response I'm looking at some of these questions and I'm hoping that you will of course feel free to comment as you wish. One of the questions involved Ho Chi Minh and this person is curious as to whether he communicated with his followers through a medium and if he is back on Urantia or only communicating through a midwayer.

Monjoronson: These communications that are recorded on your world are undertaken by various methods for contact as you have illustrated in your question that the intervention of a midway personality who can transfer messages indicate. We are always receptive to the further input by those who have left your world and have undertaken their morontia ascension wherein they may help provide insight to how the human mind may receive our further ministry.

You are aware of the four and twenty counselors seated, all one time mortals of Urantia. I do not in any manner imply that Ho Chi Minh is so seated on the counsel but his service to your world continues. I will return to my perspective of the reincarnation experience and draw a parallel. Those who admire that personality will readily receive communication be they truly from or merely perceivingly so from that individual. There are names for a great many contact personalities who have touched the minds of human beings that will resonate with the receiving human.

You will be humorously entertained when you leave this world to discover common [names] applied to few individuals. It is not important to myself that I be recognized for I am here to represent the deities of Paradise and to do so in the manner projected by Michael and then my energy signature will crawl out from under the bush. Let me just conclude by saying that we will always draw from experience of human beings who have left your world and make attempts to integrate our efforts with your orientation deriving the wisdom from souls who have moved on and you may or may not correctly identify who that higher personality is who is projecting those teachings towards the receptive humans on your world.

Question #5: [Mary] There is a question here as to the origins of the human race and in the Urantia Book we are taught that we evolved and this questioner has been reading other teachings that state we are the progeny of a humanity that unexpectedly fell from grace or full consciousness and were abruptly cast unprepared into the world following the fall of Atlantis nearly 13 millennia ago. This question reminds me of how last week we addressed the issue of discernment so if you would address it we would appreciate it, thank you.

Monjoronson: For those of you who have undertaken the comprehension of the teachings of the Urantia papers you will understand that such a description as a fallen humanity unprepared to live upon your world speaks similarly to the Nodite race which contains elements of a visiting population, those from another sphere and as well those derived from the races existent on Urantia. The origin of the human race is multi-faceted. You have elements that are imported from other realms and you have elements that are derived from the very soil of your planet.

There is no one simple description of how this wonderful set of human beings has come to be on Urantia. One may look at what is taught by way of the revelators of the Urantia book as merely a modern description of the same principles of the Atlantean legends. The thread of truth is similar, the manifold subsequent embellishments to [precede] truth are all varied by way of the active imagination of the human being. An ardent believer in Atlantis will find the Dalamatian story of the planetary headquarters and the Garden of Eden of the violet race to be akin but different by description and likewise will one who follows the teachings of the Urantia book find the Atlantean legends to be akin but differing in description.

Therefore seek a fundamental principle and realize that history is only a sketch minus great detail of what has transpired on your world. Not only are episodes that have occurred not noted in history but what is noted is the memory patterns of episodes and those memory patterns are not the episodes themselves and so have changed even the event so recorded. I will wrap up this question with one more comment, look toward your destiny. Your origin is your springboard but your destiny is your future, your goal and your [ Jonathan searches for a word and I will give him several] splendor, magnificence, radiance, your high standing as a finaliter.

Question #6: [Mary] Thank you so much Monjoronson. In Nigeria there are people who claim to have seen mermaids and there is a questioner who would like to know if mermaids exist and if so for what purpose.

Monjoronson: I must return again to some of my comments already stated this evening and that is the projection of the human mind in an effort to comprehend realities do so with a description that are of human origin or planetary based. A mermaid is merely a composite of several life forms you have experienced on your world and they are then elevated to positions that are magical or have degrees of splendor about them just as you have the legends of a man with four hooves and a tail, just as you have legends again of a man with two hooves and two arms and horns.

The purpose is for the soul to continue to seek for higher truth and discern better ways of being, of becoming a high son or daughter of God. The existence of such entities may or may not have a personality behind the projected imagery. One who prefers a mermaid will not see an angel with wings and haloes and light radiating all about it and another who does not resonate with angels may see an alien on a foreign space craft. Though I am not concerned with such human descriptions and am more rather inclined to elevate deeper meanings, higher truths and greater cosmic values that may be absorbed by way of such encounters.

Become clear in your pursuit of pure spiritual reality and be less concerned with those apparent factual descriptions for they are often linked to the historicity of mankind's understanding of the way of life on this planet often devoid of the context of the entire universe and the grand plan for everything.

Mary: Thank you Monjoronson and I would personally like to express my appreciation for your patience and for understanding of our human natures. We look about us and see so many distractions for our mind to dwell on and be entertained and made curious about and we wonder and I appreciate very much you're directing our mind to perhaps look deeper into the spiritual significance of the material imagery that we see before us, or that other people have seen and talk about. Thank you for coaching us and guiding us towards higher realities that are far more significant or real than the things that can seem so concretely and real to human eyes and once again I personally thank you for you're coaching and your guidance and that's all the questions we have tonight. Once again, thank you so much for being here with us and helping us.

Monjoronson: You are welcome and I will make one last comment. As a young child anticipates the arrival of a tooth fairy, the Easter bunny or a Santa Claus and in maturity decides that such entities were fairy tales and the shift will often occur such that the same anticipation of the arrival of the personality will be Jesus or Buddha and some will make the next step and dismiss the reality of those personalities and sever the anticipation of connection. But the human soul longs to connect with divine spirit and the forms will change just as the fashion of your clothing has changed over the centuries but still serves the same purpose of protecting your body from cold, heat, sun and wet.


Do look ever more deeply into the presence of God and your communion with God and your identity with God. You are a child of God, you have the birthmark of divine spirit. Even your greatest concepts on Urantia describing higher realities will appear to be sketchy descriptions in the ages to come. I thank all who have submitted questions to me. I honor you for your curiosity, for your desire to know, for your longing to understand and to sort out that which may be confusing for Urantia is a topsy turvy world when it comes to comprehending cosmic reality. Farewell.